Topics for online voice chat meeting September 26th 2023

Topic threads for our monthly online voice chat meetings
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Vezzra
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Topics for online voice chat meeting September 26th 2023

#1 Post by Vezzra »

This is the topics thread for our next online voice chat meeting on Tuesday, September 26th 2023.

Please post suggestions for topics and discuss them here.

Ophiuchus
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Re: Topics for online voice chat meeting September 26th 2023

#2 Post by Ophiuchus »

Automatic weekly test snap
Any code or patches in anything posted here is released under the CC and GPL licences in use for the FO project.

Look, ma... four combat bouts!

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Geoff the Medio
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Re: Topics for online voice chat meeting September 26th 2023

#3 Post by Geoff the Medio »

I'll be travelling so probly can't join.

BlueAward
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Re: Topics for online voice chat meeting September 26th 2023

#4 Post by BlueAward »

wobbly wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 1:56 pm I'm going to bring up what to do with Gotv for the next dev meeting which hopefully I'll also attend (it's slighty awkward as that's 4 a.m. AEST). On the one hand I'd like them to work in an interesting way that works for both what Blueaward enjoys, and that also works if you aren't forcing your mind to jump through hoops to make it work. On the other hand I'd like someone else to balance it, so I don't cop another accusation of being part of the big ship only conspiracy, which for me got old before it even started. I suspect there's issues here, why can the gaping hole in the universe be scrapped with a single click? Why is the point of destruction providing supply and refueling? Is 2 empires rigging their outer boundaries with doomsday devices actually good for game play? Are they actually useful? If they are useful is there sufficient counters?

I could fix the current situation where they are currently a 100% counter to experimentor monsters, but if I'm bothering, I'd rather know where they are intended to sit in final play.
wobbly wanted to discuss gateway to the void nereworking

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Re: Topics for online voice chat meeting September 26th 2023

#5 Post by BlueAward »

I'd like to have a go at making non-colonizing yet ship-building species able to set up outposts per viewtopic.php?t=12849&sid=a95a3d65e19e0 ... f9997f4c51

Originally I was thinking about tying it to exobots, to give explanation how cannotcolonize can build outposts, but the general voice of the people seens to be that yes, it is surprising that shipbuilding species can't set up outposts (outposts can then be colonized by whatever colonizing species), and should just outright be possible to do, without exobots in the picture. Also originally I was looking into ways of doing that on the scripting side, but seems better to change on the backend indeed.

Generally outposting is pretty much colonization with (population) capacity 0. Akin to planet with 0 population is an outpost. But this leads to this issue that if species CannotColonize, yet can build ships, it still can't build outposts.

So first of all, if you agree with that sentiment, that non-colonizing, yet ship-building species, should be able to set up outposts.

And then, how far to go. Some least changes would presumably be to except / special case outposting part in some places, like figuring out if species can build a ship with outpost part (that even though it not CanColonize, it should still be able to build ship designs with PC_COLONY but 0 capacity?). And then Ship.CanColonize should not check for ship's species CanColonize, just focus on its ShipDesign's CanColonize (that checks for PC_COLONY parts).

But I think it would be good to split out the concept of outposting from colonization more officially, to make this cleaner. So the outposting ship part would not be PC_COLONY anymore, and be either PC_GENERAL or set up entire new class of ship part PC_OUTPOST? Should we have a separate trait CanOutpost, or just assume CanProduceShips implies CanOutpost? Ship designs and ships should probably get CanOutpost either way even if species don't get such trait. And then there's the AI angle... Perhaps not bad if it gets confused about CannotColonize species being able to outpost because that's new, but not to break the behavior of CanColonize species (need to check how AI distinguishes colonizers and outposters, which should be clearer anyway if those are separate concepts)

Could also do in two steps, first try to do the least changes of relaxing what CanColonize means in some cases (involving outposts), and only after giving that a go, split outposting into separate concept officially (probably would go this route even though the second step is what makes more sense to me, but first step is what informs on when to use CanOutpost anyway)

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Re: Topics for online voice chat meeting September 26th 2023

#6 Post by wobbly »

BlueAward wrote: Fri Sep 22, 2023 9:47 am
wobbly wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 1:56 pm I'm going to bring up what to do with Gotv for the next dev meeting which hopefully I'll also attend (it's slighty awkward as that's 4 a.m. AEST). On the one hand I'd like them to work in an interesting way that works for both what Blueaward enjoys, and that also works if you aren't forcing your mind to jump through hoops to make it work. On the other hand I'd like someone else to balance it, so I don't cop another accusation of being part of the big ship only conspiracy, which for me got old before it even started. I suspect there's issues here, why can the gaping hole in the universe be scrapped with a single click? Why is the point of destruction providing supply and refueling? Is 2 empires rigging their outer boundaries with doomsday devices actually good for game play? Are they actually useful? If they are useful is there sufficient counters?

I could fix the current situation where they are currently a 100% counter to experimentor monsters, but if I'm bothering, I'd rather know where they are intended to sit in final play.
wobbly wanted to discuss gateway to the void nereworking
I doubt I'll be able to make it to this meeting, hence why I didn't post here myself. Its not urgent.

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Vezzra
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Re: Topics for online voice chat meeting September 26th 2023

#7 Post by Vezzra »

I don't know if anyone who wanted to join our online meeting today is checking the forums, but in case someone does, here a short heads up why the meeting hasn't started. I've posted this also on the announcement thread, in case someone looks there.

Unfortunately I'm experiencing technical difficulties joining the Jitsi meeting today. I just can't join the meeting room, with neither of my browsers on neither of my computers. I don't know what's going on, but I haven't been able to fix the problem.

Meaning, I can't join today. Meaning also, someone else needs to do a login as moderator (you can use Google, Facebook or Github accounts for authentication) to launch the meeting so anyone else can join.

Sorry for the mishap. I'll keep trying for a while, maybe I can get the meeting going. I'll post an update if I succeed.

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Vezzra
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Re: Topics for online voice chat meeting September 26th 2023

#8 Post by Vezzra »

Ok, Grummel managed to start the meeting. We'll wait for some time if anyone else joins.

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Re: Topics for online voice chat meeting September 26th 2023

#9 Post by Vezzra »

Update: at 6:30pm UTC only Grummel, Cj and I (Vezzra) have been present, and none of the people who suggested topics, so we decided to end the meeting.

See you next time!

BlueAward
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Re: Topics for online voice chat meeting September 26th 2023

#10 Post by BlueAward »

I did not expect to be needed for any discussion. I just wanted it to be taken into consideration, should non-CanColonize but CanBuildShips species be able to build outposts, yes or no. Dunno who calls the shots, but not me. So whoever calls the shots, would be nice to consider that idea, I thought. And I didn't feel needed for such discussion

Besides, on the practical side of things, I think it is well ironed out now with Ophiuchus' PR https://github.com/freeorion/freeorion/pull/4750 so it's only the question whether it makes it or not.

Otherwise basically not clear to me what's the process for proposing gameplay changes and getting a definite yes or no (or a very stern "maybe" 😂)

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Vezzra
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Re: Topics for online voice chat meeting September 26th 2023

#11 Post by Vezzra »

BlueAward wrote: Wed Sep 27, 2023 12:43 pmOtherwise basically not clear to me what's the process for proposing gameplay changes and getting a definite yes or no (or a very stern "maybe" 😂)
The recommended way is to create a thread on the Other Game Design subforum where you present/explain your idea/proposal. Depending on if you just want to brainstorm some ideas or want to discuss a concrete feature request, please also open a feature request issue on Github (in the latter case). Put a link to the forum discussion thread in it, and a link to the Github issue in the forum discussion thread.

But basically the place to present/discuss gameplay changes, new mechanics and features etc. is the Other Game Design subforum.

The online voice chat meetings are just some additional platform for those of our contributors who want to discuss FO related stuff in that form too. Some things can be better or more efficiently discussed by talking directly to each other, than exchanging forum posts. But that of course requires that the people suggesting topics attend - it's a bit difficult to discuss a topic if those who want to discuss it in the voice chat meeting in the first place are not present... ;)

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