Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

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Ophiuchus
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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#211 Post by Ophiuchus »

my opinion on the gifting-to-allies and performing tasks for other empires they are not able to:
I also think that is basically the game with those fixed relationships.

The fixed relationships take away agency, so we either go roleplaying or have to adjust the expectations.

E.g. i keep wobblys scouts out of o01eg's (my ally) space. He can't because they are at peace.
Sometimes LR shows up and then the fleets get repurposed.
o01eg wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:25 am Do anyone also seen issue with Structural Damage by Fleet summary?
wobbly wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 1:15 pm What am I actually looking for? I mean the following is certainly weird: look at the fleet total damage and look at the ship.
yes, the fighter damage is missing in the fleet summary. that must have been "recent".

another thing: i get checksum errors (since two weeks or so). do we have a new version i missed?
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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#212 Post by o01eg »

Ophiuchus wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 10:07 am another thing: i get checksum errors (since two weeks or so). do we have a new version i missed?
No, it cannot be that case as the server was running 2 months 26 days without restart.
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Oberlus
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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#213 Post by Oberlus »

Ophiuchus wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 10:07 amE.g. i keep wobblys scouts out of o01eg's (my ally) space. He can't because they are at peace.
Sometimes LR shows up and then the fleets get repurposed.
That's awful to my taste. Having to keep gifting and gifting back the fleets depending on who is around. Really annoying. Interesting how other players can find it as a benefit or something worth adapting to.

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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#214 Post by Ophiuchus »

Oberlus wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 11:21 am
Ophiuchus wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 10:07 amE.g. i keep wobblys scouts out of o01eg's (my ally) space. He can't because they are at peace.
Sometimes LR shows up and then the fleets get repurposed.
That's awful to my taste. Having to keep gifting and gifting back the fleets depending on who is around. Really annoying. Interesting how other players can find it as a benefit or something worth adapting to.
it helps testing gifting, so that is a plus.

i do not think there is any benefit from a gameplay perspective.

i am not sure what you mean "worth adapting to"; these are the normal game rules. we did a exotic set up, now we have exotic consequences.

I can imagine you would feel a bit different with a different starting position. But maybe not much.
The set up makes proxy moves (almost?) a necessity.
Personally I am also struggling with the set up. I think I learned enough from it and would not mind stopping the game.
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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#215 Post by Ophiuchus »

o01eg wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 10:51 am
Ophiuchus wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 10:07 am another thing: i get checksum errors (since two weeks or so). do we have a new version i missed?
No, it cannot be that case as the server was running 2 months 26 days without restart.
jikes. seems i did not repush to the development channel in a while...
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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#216 Post by LienRag »

Ophiuchus wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 10:07 am another thing: i get checksum errors (since two weeks or so). do we have a new version i missed?
Me too.
Are you using your snap like I do ?

Also, the Colony Base Hull graphic has been replaced by a new one (quite pretty, actually) but the Spatial Flux Composite Hull now uses the old Colony Base Hull graphic ?
The "ginger" one was more fitting imho.

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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#217 Post by Ophiuchus »

LienRag wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 12:01 pm
Ophiuchus wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 10:07 am another thing: i get checksum errors (since two weeks or so). do we have a new version i missed?
Me too.
Are you using your snap like I do ?
yes, i f* up the publish (it timed out and reverted to the default beta, so current 0.5). probably I should stop misusing the snap branch feature.

for the moment, do a sudo snap refresh.
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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#218 Post by BlueAward »

Seems like Oberlus and Ophiuchus outright wish to move on, I can only imagine Endhu would welcome a change as well, and Daybreak does not seem to be enjoying the game either, though on a more fundamental level (dislikes changes to stability and influence I gather in v5, so not sure if we'd have him for the next game in general.. Ophiuchus probably would be missing as well?).

So presumably it's like half of the players already, not sure about o01eg, LR and wobbly? One more stronger voice probably would tip the scales. o01eg maybe would prefer testing newer version too, while LR probably would be rather dissapointed? I have a feeling wobbly is somewhat like me in this regard - personally, I would enjoy another setup (particularly no diplomacy), as I was saying from the start, but by now we are where we are and I am invested and would be dissapointed not to see some end game stuff. But I'm fine moving on if there's consensus.

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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#219 Post by wobbly »

BlueAward wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:07 pm Seems like Oberlus and Ophiuchus outright wish to move on, I can only imagine Endhu would welcome a change as well, and Daybreak does not seem to be enjoying the game either, though on a more fundamental level (dislikes changes to stability and influence I gather in v5, so not sure if we'd have him for the next game in general.. Ophiuchus probably would be missing as well?).

So presumably it's like half of the players already, not sure about o01eg, LR and wobbly? One more stronger voice probably would tip the scales. o01eg maybe would prefer testing newer version too, while LR probably would be rather dissapointed? I have a feeling wobbly is somewhat like me in this regard - personally, I would enjoy another setup (particularly no diplomacy), as I was saying from the start, but by now we are where we are and I am invested and would be dissapointed not to see some end game stuff. But I'm fine moving on if there's consensus.
Yeah for me it'll be mixed. A shame not to continue, but good to have a newer version. I'd like to see how the new replicon function in game, I changed them but only gave them rudimentary balance testing. Of course it's not guaranteed we'll get a Replicon empire. I also just put a PR in to stop ancient guardians triggering xenophobic effects and I'd like to see if necessity is better balanced.

So yeah, I'll go with the general consensus.

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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#220 Post by Oberlus »

Ophiuchus wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 11:59 am I can imagine you would feel a bit different with a different starting position. But maybe not much.
If I had the strongest empire in the game I would feel different about something: let's keep playing until I crash LR, for the fun. Conversely, being at the opposite extreme (I gather LR is stronger than me and it is a matter of time that he attacks and starts my demise, unless I am just bullshitting to con him into attacking me now for and easier counterattack...), I don't have that motivation.
But the annoyance from seeing people doing the gifting thingy to scape invasions would bother me more if I was on the attack, so maybe I would feel even less interested on the game.


Anyways, I'm not asking to stop the game as long as others want to continue it.

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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#221 Post by BlueAward »

Wait did I jump to conclusions too soon ? Are we doing this ? There is post about 23rd game, so I guess it means this universe is ending, so long and thanks for all the fish?

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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#222 Post by Ophiuchus »

Ophiuchus wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 12:36 pm
LienRag wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 12:01 pm
Ophiuchus wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 10:07 am another thing: i get checksum errors (since two weeks or so). do we have a new version i missed?
Me too.
Are you using your snap like I do ?
yes, i f* up the publish (it timed out and reverted to the default beta, so current 0.5). probably I should stop misusing the snap branch feature.

for the moment, do a sudo snap refresh.
also you could do a snap hold forever if you want to isolate yourself from my stupidity
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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#223 Post by LienRag »

I like the game, both because I had an interesting start and because the diplomacy, as I said, is devious (diplomacy that you chose to try, it wasn't my own choice).
There is only one bug, more an exploit actually, the one that makes possible the gifting of buildings that are normally destroyed on conquest. It's easy to get a collective agreement that except for test purposes (which imho should be done at least once) these buildings are to be destroyed immediately after the gift. And since it's visible publicly, enforcing this agreement is easy too.

On another hand, it's not really useful to force people to play.

But there's a real problem about the games getting abandoned mid-way, how many MP games did one person win regularly ? IIRC, none since I started to join multiplayer games.
Fixing that problem (making the endgame less boring, I guess) would be a priority over just restarting again and again the MP game.

So, I'll follow the collective decision, but if we stop the game without addressing in any way the main problem, I'm not sure to join future games.

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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#224 Post by Oberlus »

LienRag wrote: Tue Jan 31, 2023 9:18 pm But there's a real problem about the games getting abandoned mid-way, how many MP games did one person win regularly ? IIRC, none since I started to join multiplayer games.
Fixing that problem (making the endgame less boring, I guess) would be a priority over just restarting again and again the MP game.

So, I'll follow the collective decision, but if we stop the game without addressing in any way the main problem, I'm not sure to join future games.
Previous games that finished before getting a "Victory!" message in-game were stopped usually because there was a clear winner, some players were already eliminated, and starting a new game is good for letting others play, update server with newer changes, playtest those changes sooner, and so on.

What is that other problem that makes end-games boring? I wasn't aware of that (only in single player, when your steamroll is ridiculous).

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Re: Twenty-second game on the multiplayer slow game server

#225 Post by wobbly »

LienRag wrote: Tue Jan 31, 2023 9:18 pm There is only one bug, more an exploit actually, the one that makes possible the gifting of buildings that are normally destroyed on conquest.
No 2 bugs. Gifting the turn of invasion was bugged as well. There's also potentially a 3rd bug, allied supply not working properly. My question for you is can you actually build at Firma alpha? My 2 supply planet at Metaluna should reach there but the UI is showing 0 supply Firma alpha as blocking the supply. (turn 89 for reference).

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