Premade Ship Designs

[OllyG]

Every time I start a new game I design ships in the first turn - the same ships in every game. The premade designs don't seem so good to me. I want to see if everyone else is doing the same as me.

I take the Mark I (Basic Medium Hull, Mass Driver 1, Mass Driver 1) and change it to Small Mark I (Basic Small Hull, Mass Driver 1). I then often start building Small Mark I right away. Two Small Mark I have the same damage and structure as one Mark I but more fuel and speed for slightly less cost. They also seem better at fighting Sentries since a Sentry has a single Laser 4, which kills a Mark I or a Small Mark I in one hit, so if you are using Small Mark I you only loose one Mass Driver each time the Sentry fires.

I also rename the Troop Ship (Basic Small Hull, Ground Troop Pod) to Small Troop Ship and design a new Troop Ship (Basic Medium Hull, Ground Troop Pod, Ground Troop Pod, Ground Troop Pod). The larger troop ship is cheaper per trooper, but the small one is still useful when you need less than 6 troops. - I also change the description from 'a brigade of ground troops' to '2 units of ground troops' or '6 units of ground troops' for the Small and larger ships.

I use these designs in every game. I've never built the Premade Mark II, Mark III, or Mark IV. I often invade planets and fight Sentries before I research better Hulls. Advanced Premade designs should be something that many players would use.

For example if I research Active Radar I make a new Scout (Basic Small Hull, Active Radar). If I have a better Hull I use that instead, but I try to remember to use the Active Radar part! I think that as soon as Active Radar is researched you would only build the Premade Scout design by accident, it would be good to have that design replaced each time a new detection system is research (if only to remind the player to upgrade all their designs which use detection systems).

Another example is the Cryonic Colony Pod, as soon as that is researched I never use the basic Colony Pod any more. A premade design using Cryonic Colony Pod would make sense. An example many players would use is: Cryonic Colony Ship (Organic Hull, Cryonic Colony Pod). It's a basic design which is likely to be used (but not every game!)

I think that rather than the Mark II, Mark III and Mark IV currently, there should be a few premade designs using the first few hulls and ship parts that a typical player would research (but doesn't start with), just to show new players a bit of a range of designs. Here are my suggestions:

Advanced Scout (Basic Small Hull, Active Radar)
Asteroid Scout (Small Asteroid Hull, Optical Scanner, Extra Fuel Tank)
Energy Scout (Compressed Energy Hull, Optical Scanner)
Asteroid Troop Ship (Asteroid Hull, Ground Troop Pod x 6)
Organic Troop Ship (Organic Hull, Ground Troop Pod x 4)
Energy Troop Ship (Compressed Energy Hull, Ground Troop Pod)
Energy Combat Ship (Compressed Energy Hull, Laser 1)
Robotic Combat Ship (Robotic Hull, Robotic Interface: Shields, Laser 1 x 4)
Organic Combat Ship (Organic Hull, Defence Grid, Zortrium Armor Plating, Laser 1 x 2)
Cryonic Colony Base (Colony Base Hull, Cryonic Colony Pod)
Cryonic Colony Ship (Organic Hull, Cryonic Colony Pod)
Cryonic Colony Ship (Small Asteroid Hull, Cryonic Colony Pod)
Mark II (Basic Medium Hull, Defence Grid, Laser 1 x 2)

I expect a lot of new players will research Laser and shields. I don't think the premade designs should go beyond the very basic level, but something for each type of hull is needed and something to show that troop ships can be bigger or cheaper is important, since it seems a lot of beginning players don't realise that the ship design isn't just for combat ships. I'm not sure if the basic combat ships for each hull should be Mass Driver 1, but people always research lasers when they first play a space themed game right?

On a final note, I never use the Basic Large Hull and I want the order of hulls the be small, medium, large on the list of available hulls at the beginning of the game, Currently its medium, small, large.

I mean it about the Basic Large Hull - I think it is useless!

[Geoff the Medio]

...it would be good to have that [scout] design replaced each time a new detection system is research (if only to remind the player to upgrade all their designs which use detection systems).

This is the same refitting / upgrading issue that has been discussed at length in other threads. I think a better solution is to make the existing part work better when later techs are researched and/or strategic resources gained, rather than requiring new designs to be created with a new part.

[MatGB]

Every time I start a new game I design ships in the first turn - the same ships in every game. The premade designs don't seem so good to me. I want to see if everyone else is doing the same as me.

I don't use the same designs as you, but I agree most of the premades are completely useless, I mentioned thinking of revamping them in the ongoing ship balancing thread but it wasn't a major priority for me at the time.

I take the Mark I (Basic Medium Hull, Mass Driver 1, Mass Driver 1) and change it to Small Mark I (Basic Small Hull, Mass Driver 1). I then often start building Small Mark I right away. Two Small Mark I have the same damage and structure as one Mark I but more fuel and speed for slightly less cost. They also seem better at fighting Sentries since a Sentry has a single Laser 4, which kills a Mark I or a Small Mark I in one hit, so if you are using Small Mark I you only loose one Mass Driver each time the Sentry fires.

I don't do this, instead I take a medium hull and mount a gun and armour on it, in fact I think all the "mark X" shiops should have a single gun and a single armour plate, however I have in the past run small hull warships and think having them as options is a good example.

I also rename the Troop Ship (Basic Small Hull, Ground Troop Pod) to Small Troop Ship and design a new Troop Ship (Basic Medium Hull, Ground Troop Pod, Ground Troop Pod, Ground Troop Pod). The larger troop ship is cheaper per trooper, but the small one is still useful when you need less than 6 troops. - I also change the description from 'a brigade of ground troops' to '2 units of ground troops' or '6 units of ground troops' for the Small and larger ships.

I never change descriptions, but yes, pretty much guaranteed to make a bigger troop ship fairly quickly, and definitely agree that this needs to be clearer for newer players.

I use these designs in every game. I've never built the Premade Mark II, Mark III, or Mark IV. I often invade planets and fight Sentries before I research better Hulls. Advanced Premade designs should be something that many players would use.

I tend to rush organics most games and hold off building fighting ships until they're ready, but definitely agree the later Mark designs are fairly useless, and I tend to hold off engaging sentries until I've 3 or 4 Organic/laser/zortrium ships to take them down reliably.

Another example is the Cryonic Colony Pod, as soon as that is researched I never use the basic Colony Pod any more. A premade design using Cryonic Colony Pod would make sense. An example many players would use is: Cryonic Colony Ship (Organic Hull, Cryonic Colony Pod). It's a basic design which is likely to be used (but not every game!)

Agree completely, my personal install has cryonic colony base, cry ship and organic cryo ship and I virtually always use all three at some point in each game.

I think that rather than the Mark II, Mark III and Mark IV currently, there should be a few premade designs using the first few hulls and ship parts that a typical player would research (but doesn't start with), just to show new players a bit of a range of designs. Here are my suggestions:

Agree with this, not sure on all your exact designs, but agree it's needed. Plus, better description text saying they're sample designs, etc would be good.

On a final note, I never use the Basic Large Hull and I want the order of hulls the be small, medium, large on the list of available hulls at the beginning of the game, Currently its medium, small, large.

I mean it about the Basic Large Hull - I think it is useless!

In my patch for robotics and balancing generally I recosted the large hull down to 30 base and upped the speed to 60, this made it merely expensive and crap instead of completely and utterly useless and a waste of PP, I ought to bump that thread I think it's been overlooked. But yeah, as is it's useless, back when the game was first launched I remember using them because they were the only three hulls, but now? Not a chance, ever.

[Dilvish]

Every time I start a new game I design ships in the first turn - the same ships in every game.

Someday, I hope someone will be motivated enough to code up a mechanism to save and load preferred ship designs (actually, sets of preferred designs). I'm sure it won't be me in the next few months at least, but if nothing has happened on this front for another year or two then maybe I'll get on it

[OllyG]

I have put the designs I mentioned at the beginning into premade_ship_designs.txt and updated en.txt. But I don't know how to make a patch!

I've tried it out and there are no error messages (any more) and it's released under GPL 2.0 and CC-BY-SA 3.0.

[MatGB]

Patch attached. It appears to want to move a large chunk of en.txt by a few lines, no idea why.

Olly, still learning how to make patches (ergo, this one might not be perfect but should work), you need an SVN client like ToroiseSVN and it's fairly straightforward from there, took me a bit of trial and error but it is a lot easier to work on game stuff once you've got it going.

[Geoff the Medio]

Committed (original submission). Shouldn't cause problems, so don't see any reason not to...