Dummies

For what's not in 'Top Priority Game Design'. Post your ideas, visions, suggestions for the game, rules, modifications, etc.

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LienRag
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Dummies

#1 Post by LienRag »

Would it be possible to have "dummy" ships (or ship parts) that would echo their numbers on the Galaxy map ?

I mean, one could buy a cheap ship and put "dummy" parts on it and each part would look like there was nothing in it, but create a dummy duplicate of the ship on the Galaxy Map (no effect in combat).

If we have also "dummy" parts that obscure the next part of the ship and if all these "dummy" parts look like "no part", it allows for a lot of deception.

Ideally, having 40 more detection than the stealth value of the ship (or of the dummy if we want different dummy part to have different stealth value) would reveal the real number of ships and the real nature of parts.

Example :
  • 1 - Real ship : Symbiotic Hull with two Flak (external) and two Fuel Tanks (internal)
    Appears normally in the Galaxy map to anyone with a Detection value of 15 or more.
  • 2 - Ship with one "dummy ship" part : Symbiotic Hull with one Flak, one "dummy ship" external part, and two Fuel Tanks.
    Appears as two identical ships in the Galaxy Map, each of them having only one external part (the Flak).
    To enemy Empires with detection of 55 or more, they would appear as the full design : One ship with one Flak, two Fuel tanks, and one external dummy part.
    (In the next examples I'll skip how they appear to enemy with 55+ detection value as it's quite obvious now imho)
  • 3 - Ditto with the "dummy ship" part replacing the Fuel tank rather than the Flak.
    Appears as two identical ships in the Galaxy Map, each of them having only one internal part (the Fuel tank).
  • 4 - Ship with two "dummy ship" part : Symbiotic Hull with one Flak, one "dummy ship" external part, One "dummy ship" internal part and one Fuel Tanks.
    Appears as three identical ships in the Galaxy Map, all of them having only one internal part and one external part (one Flak, one Fuel tank)
  • 5 - Three incomplete design ships : Symbiotic Hull with one Flak and one Fuel tank.
    Appears as three identical ships in the Galaxy Map, all of them having only one internal part and one external part (one Flak, one Fuel tank)
    So exactly the same as number 4, not possible to distinguish the two without 55 detection power (75 if the ship uses Electronic Damper instead of the Fuel Tank).
  • 6 - Ship with one "dummy part" part : Symbiotic Hull with two Flaks, one "dummy ship" internal part, and one Fuel Tank.
    Appears as one ship in the Galaxy Map, having two external parts (Flaks) and no internal part.
  • 7 - Ship with two "dummy ship" parts : Symbiotic Hull with two "dummy ship" internal parts, and two Flaks.
    Appears as three identical ships in the Galaxy Map, all of them having only two Flaks and no internal part.
    So impossible to distinguish from three ships of the model 6 without 55 or more Detection value.
  • 8 - Ship with incomplete ship design : Symbiotic Hull with two Flaks, and no internal part.
    Appears as one ship in the Galaxy Map, having two Flaks and no internal part.
    So three of these ships would appear exactly as model 7.
  • 9 - and so on...
We could also have "dummy" ship parts that would make the hull look like another hull (so a regular Asteroid Hull would look like a Big Asteroid Hull, and the missing slots in it would make the other players wary of what is inside them - nothing of course since these extra slots do not exist, but only the owner Empire and other ones with 40+ Detection value would know that). I believe this would need more backend change though.

edit : corrected some mix-up in the numbers
Last edited by LienRag on Fri Mar 12, 2021 9:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Geoff the Medio
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Re: Dummies

#2 Post by Geoff the Medio »

Something like this would be implemented by having the server reportin a different ship design to a player than the true ship design. The specific suggestions about "dummy parts" or similar probably aren't how that would be implemented.

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LienRag
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Re: Dummies

#3 Post by LienRag »

Geoff the Medio wrote: Fri Mar 12, 2021 2:03 pm Something like this would be implemented by having the server reportin a different ship design to a player than the true ship design. The specific suggestions about "dummy parts" or similar probably aren't how that would be implemented.
Oh, yes I didn't think about how a cheating player could analyze the trafic sent by the server to find the real nature of the ships.
No idea of what can be done then.

Though I liked my ideas because they were (imho at least) KISS while giving a variety of options, as well as keeping some constraints for the player to have to manage carefully.

Ophiuchus
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Re: Dummies

#4 Post by Ophiuchus »

LienRag wrote: Fri Mar 12, 2021 9:22 pm
Geoff the Medio wrote: Fri Mar 12, 2021 2:03 pm Something like this would be implemented by having the server reportin a different ship design to a player than the true ship design. The specific suggestions about "dummy parts" or similar probably aren't how that would be implemented.
Oh, yes I didn't think about how a cheating player could analyze the trafic sent by the server to find the real nature of the ships.
I think you missed geoffs point, i dont think he was talking about the traffic.

The stuff you suggested does not map well to the implementation - reporting a different ship design is rather straightforward.
Any code or patches in anything posted here is released under the CC and GPL licences in use for the FO project.

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